Water In Basement-expansion Tank?
Hi there,
I am going to have a home inspected but wanted to know if anyone had ideas on this. I am buying a home that has water in the basement [actual puddles]. There is a hot water heater but it is electric heat, no boiler. The owner is telling me 2 things that might? not make sense? He says it has to do with the expansion tank? and that the basement needs to be sealed, the cold ground outside is hitting the warmer basement air and causing condensation this has been compounded by the humid, rainy summer we have had. He says it is not a drainage issue. Does this make sense? What does he mean about the expansion tank causing this too?
An expansion tank is used for hot water heat (boiler) - since you don;t have a boiler, you shouldn't have an expansion tank. Have the owner empty the tank, since it is unneeded, and see if the water problem stops - hint---> it won't/
Most likely the water is a result of the rain, not some concocted story about condensation. A $50 dehimidifier will confirm this.
Since the owner is so willing to tell you what is wrong, allow him to have it fixed, or budget something like 10k in your bid to go into escrow to fix the water problem - my guess is he'll come up with a solution when you start holding back money.
Make it a point to stop by the next time it is raining and see for yourself.
JohnCl
I see you are in MA, is the basement a walkout? If not do you have a sump pump? If you have a sump pump check the to see if there is water in the crock. If there is water around the crock then check to see if it is draining to the outside. If you have a walkout without a sump tell him to show you where his drain is for the drain tile. That could also be your problem. If neither of those are your problem the water could be coming from a window a door or just coming through the walls. If it is coming through the walls you will need to get it waterproofed and they cost about 5-10K around here. I don't know what it will cost there. How old is the house and what kind of foundation is it? Block, Stone or poured concrete?
It could be so many things...
Are the puddles located in any specific locations? IE, center of the basement, or around the walls?
Condensation is a possibility but should be easy to determine. When the AC is on the ductwork would be wet and dripping water. If the cold ductwork is dry I wouldn't buy into a cool floor being the cause.
A couple fairly obvious things to check, clogged floordrain the AC dumps into? Bad or missing gutters?
Thanks for all the replies.
Jackso, It is a walkout basement. house built in 1985 poured concrete. What is the issue with walkout basements and drainage? I did mention putting a sump pump in [there isn't one] and he insists it is not a drainage issue. I can tell by basement door and window rot it has been a long standing problem, Why would he have an expansion tank if is electric heat. Is it for the water heater?
Hi Mykle,
The puddles are basically the entire basement floors since some areas may be slightly lower than others [basically a flat floor] they forms puddles. There is no AC unit, just window ACs in the upstair bedrooms. He is saying the basement needs to be sealed, my instinct is that it is more than just this.
Holy in denial bat man! This dude must be related to Cleopatra because if he ain't the Queen of denial he is at least a close cousin.
An expansion tank on a hot water heater (electric or gas) is there because of a problem with pressure.
(a) the city pressure has increased over time and is causing the pressure relief valve to pop sometimes so they installed an expansion tank instead of turning down the water pressure at the pressure regulator valve located at the water pipe entering the house because he didn't want to decrease the overall presure of the house (low flow in the showers sucks)
(b) When water is heated in a gas/electric hot water tank it expands, sometimes you get the pressure relief valve popping open and spilling water out of the tank to relieve the pressure. Installing am expansion tank takes care of the problem.
IF the expansion tank is broken (rare) then water could be still coming out of the pressure relief valve on the hot water tank. Just going over to it and gently applying pressure to flip it up should cause it to flip open pretty easily if this is the problem, because the pressure in the hot water tank would always be just on the verge of poping the pressure relief valve. If it takes a lot of strength to open the valve or especially if it is all crusty or shows no signs that it has been open recently then the water on the floor is not coming from the hot water tank.
Regardless if it is coming from the hot water tank, the guy should know it, because he hears the valve open all the time, and when he goes down there the hot water tank is shooting hot water all over the floor like crazy until the pressure equalizes and it shuts itself off after 2-5 minutes.
If you want to see if moisture is weeping up through the floor, tape a sheet of clear plastic down on the floor (2x2 feet would be good) and leave it overnight, come back and see if there is condesation on the plastic. If so you have some moisture moving through the slab.
However, I can guarantee you that no slab moves so much moisture through it to create standing puddles as large as you have described!
The guy sounds like he has serious drainage issues and is either dumb as a rock or is covering it up. Either way you need motivated sellers and the guy isn't motivated if he doesn't admit he has a problem.
Thanks for the great info Rehabinator! I think it is a drainage issue and I do think he is in denial. The couple has 5 months within a Ch. 13 to sell hopefully their motivation will rise and we will proceed. For now they may try to sell for the price of the land. They have 2 acres, a recent lot in their town was listed[not sold] for $430k at ~6 acres. the lots are all a minimum of 2 acres so the larger one may be subdividable. They want to get $400 and let someone tear down the house and build. The house needs a lot of work and the basement especially will turn off any retail buyer [water and mold on the windows]. I lowered my offer and while they are trying to get a better offer i am looking for another home I can flip to them. So I may make something on that end...the guy is a contractor and willing to do work if I find something that needs work. interesting business...
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the guy is a contractor and willing to do work if I find something that needs work.
You mean do work for you? I wouldn't do any business with this guy. Where there is smoke there is fire. From everything you have said this guy sounds like he is going to be nothing but trouble. Wether it will be on purpose because he is a liar and a fraud or even worse because he is just plain dumb, so dumb that he won't even take the time to find out the right way to do something.
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the guy is a contractor and willing to do work if I find something that needs work.
You mean do work for you? I wouldn't do any business with this guy. Where there is smoke there is fire. From everything you have said this guy sounds like he is going to be nothing but trouble. Wether it will be on purpose because he is a liar and a fraud or even worse because he is just plain dumb, so dumb that he won't even take the time to find out the right way to do something.
no I didn't mean I would hire him. I meant they should clear $150k plus from the sale of their home so they want to buy a house all cash or little financing for $150-200k. I am looking in some cottage communities for a small 2 bedroom home that needs work for anything close to that price. If I can find a prefor that I do not have to work on I can flip to them for a small profit. They just want to downsize to something they can afford. That way I do not have to buy/hold and rehab I can assign my contract to them for a smaller profit than AFV and let them do the work. of course 1st I have to find the property... my broker already has some programs lined up to help them buy if they have at least 50% down which they will.