He Was Very Mad When I Put My Sing In Is Back Yard!
He was very mad when I put my sign in is back yard! Last Friday I used bandit signs for the first time, I put about twenty of them all over the county. On Saturday evening I received the weirdest phone call ever! “Your putting trash all over my town with your f##king signs…” “You need a license to do this and if you don’t have one, I’m going to find out…” “I’m going to Tequesta and Jupiter (two cities in my county where I put a couple of signs) and I’m going to press charges and fine you with everything I can think of…” “I’m going to find out where you live and I’m going to trash your house and f##k you up…” Add the word f##k half a dozen time and you have a good idea of what the conversation was like! The whole time I’m trying to get is name and find out which city he’s working for and where are the signs so I can take them down but then he hangs up on me!?
Questions: If he’s really working for a town, why he didn’t tell me which one? And can he press charges even in an other town? What’s the worst I can expect?
If he’s just an other investor who’s trying to scare me from putting signs up, I think it’s pretty sad! Plus when he called me I saw his phone number on my caller ID, and when I called back I got a fax machine!?
I’m sure he’s full of it but the incident freaks me out a little. I tried to find out what are the laws for signs but all I could find where a few rules about for sale signs in your front yard. Can anyone tell me where to look? Thanks!
Live and learn,
Louis
[ Edited by louisgeorges on Date 02/01/2004 ]
Google has a Telephone Database tied to it's search engine. Go to ****Must Reach Freshman Investor status before posting URL's*** and type in the phone, with area code, and see what comes back.
Let us know what happens
Barry
I see you are in West Palm Beach.
Pehaps Data Attack has started throwing bandit signs into people's yards.
If you are going to stay in real estate, get use to the cranky, obscene, offensive, ignorant, paranoid, and weird phone calls.
I write a lot of letters and make phone calls. I am always pleasant and professional but still you can not control the person on the other end. I get people who call me up, hell in the phone "quit writing me letters", then hang up. Guess what - I have no idea who they are and I do a series of three letters - so they are getting more letters. I refuse to spend 5 minutes of my time trying to figure out who they are if they can not spend 10 seconds to tell me their name. I have people tell me my letters are offensive and they are going to tell the authorities. Well - my letters are not offensive and which authorities are they going to tell? They are insecure because my letters meantion I like to buy fixer uppers and help people in foreclosure. Can not wait until I start writing foreclosure letters and knocking on doors - that is when the fun really starts.
Look, it is just part of the biz. The first couple of times you take it to heart, but you just have to tell your self that there are just angry, nasty people in the world just looking for a reason and you happen to cross their path.
Motto to live by - "if you don't like me, there is something wrong with you"
Brenda
If this guy is cursing at you I highly doubt he works for the city. If he doesn't work for the city, I'm pretty sure he can't bring any sort of law suit against you. Also, he can't prove *YOU* put them up. Maybe one of these other investors that is trying to get rid of his competition printed up signs with YOUR phone number on them so they could have the city fine you. I think you see my point here. There are ordinances in almost every township that prohibit "street spam". You can find out by calling your local township office and asking. (I'd do it over the phone).
Ryan J. Schnabel
Barry,
I tried all morning to find him with all kind of phone search engine and nothing came up. I don’t really care anyway; I doubt is going to go through with it.
MrMike,
I don’t understand what you mean “Data Attack”?
Brenda
If he’s just an idiot trying to scare me, I’m not impressed. I had to deal with weird phone call before, but that’s the worst one so far!
Ryan,
Thanks fore the tip, I’m going to give them a call first thing Monday morning.
Thanks to all,
Louis
louisgeorges - how about this technique - Know what you are doing before you do it.
Why in the world would you go out and place signs all over the place if you have not a single clue if what you are doing is legal or not?
Do some research first, make some calls, find out what you can and can't do.
Then if you are doing nothing illegal when you get somebody who calls you like him you can respond intelligently and professionally, you could actually educate him and probably prevent him from ripping down legal signs again.
Maybe this guy was a nut case, maybe you broke the law and he is totally justified in his anger. Don't you think in the long run you would be better off running your affairs like a business that operates responsibly and ethically instead of like some slob who treats his affairs like a part time hobby?[ Edited by The-Rehabinator on Date 02/02/2004 ]
I'm not sure what you ment when you said you put a sign in his "backyard". I presume you ment in the vicinity of his residence. If you really put a sign on his property than I can understand his rage.
The best approach I've found with these people is to apologize and get off the phone as guickly as possible. There's nothing good to be gained by telling him, "so your mama".
I talk to a lot of investors all over the county, at investor club meeting and at a few investing clinics I took and they all agree that in Palm Beach county they don’t really enforce the laws about bandit signs. Technically, you’re not supposed to put signs on the side of the road without permission from the town, unless it’s your property. But if you wait for that, you’re never going to get any advertising done. Plus everybody else is putting signs up! A friend of mine told me that he puts out about 80 signs per week all over the place and someone else told me that he puts them 15 feet up in the air on telephone pole, some time he nails them right on the front of vacant houses! I went out of my way to try to find areas where there weren’t that many signs. The worst that happen to me so far, beside that idiot above, is a cop that ask me not to put signs in this town, I said “no problem, it will never happen again!”. I’m just curious to see how far I can push it, to be different from the other guys. That’s all.
His back yard is a metaphor for his territory, I’m thinking that it’s just an other investor who likes that neighborhood and he’s trying to keep the competition down. I didn’t actually put a sign on somebody’s property!
What in the world makes you think this guy is anything but a competitive investor? Want to find out who he is? Drive back thru the neighborhoods where you put your signs and look for his signs. Then have a couple of beers, call his phone and do the same thing!
Or then again, just live and let live. Compete on a level playing field and admit that your success as an investor has nothing to do with the success of your competition.
Mstory,
Either way, I completely agree!
Bigideas,
I called a couple of code enforcement agents from different town and they all said the same thing, bandit signs are illegal but as long as you don’t abuse it they’re just going to throw them away. Your competition takes care of most of it before Monday anyway!
Louis
This whacko just made you $50.
It takes about 100 no's to get a yes. Each yes you get is a $5,000 contract assingment minimum. Break it down:
$5,000/100=$50 per no. The whacko just made you $50.
Also, he will probably keel over from a heart attack this weekend. Too much stress. They are just signs man.
Doug_powell,
I really like the way you look at it!
Bigideas,
Why are you deleting all your postings?
On to the question you asked about Dattaattack:
Anyway, there was thread that Dattaattack posted about bandit signs awhile back claiming that he was throwing them away in his city. He thought they were an eyesore. So, you guys are close to each other. MrMike was making a joke inreference to that.
WheelerDealer,
Thanks, now I get it!
Data Attack, throw my signs if you want to but don’t call me!
Louis
Dear Sir, lover of small signs.
Yes yes the population do get upset on occasion. Watch your spelling and grammer you do not want to get too offensive.
My suggestion having obtained the call back number and know that it is a fax number.
You just duplicate your signs and send a copy on the fax to the fax number that you have. I mean really we must not let any sign unturned.
It is my experience that such calls are usualy harmless, the ones I worry about is when they do not call, just come to the door with this big shotgun in their hand and in a heavy dialect or patois announce that the time has come for your termination.
You must at that moment go into an anti termination mode. You might stick a pencil down the shotgun or start to admire it and tell him it is a collectors piece and you know a man that would give him $20,000 for it. Reachout your hand to take the gun so you can truly examine it. Of course once you have the gun, merely shoot, close the door and call the trash collectors. Shot guns do make a mess.
I do hope I have been helpfull.. Lucius
Lufos,
It was very helpful, I’m in tears because I’m laughing so much! I’m going to think about it all night! If somebody really does come to my house, I might not be able to keep a straight face!
Louis
Louis,
I got a call from a guy who "just wanted to know what I was up to." Then he starts telling me that it's unethical to do nothing-down deals and he's a realtor and a mortgage broker and he USED to do nothing-down deals "but I don't do that sort of thing anymore." We then talked about lease options and subjest to's at which point he informed me I am only trying to take advantage of people in dire straits...sigh...I had to terminate the call because really we were getting nowhere.
Anybody ELSE ever have someone accuse you of being predatory in this manner?
I agree with the earlier posting that we'll all have to get used to talking to weirdos on the phone...
medusa00,
I asked a fellow investor about this a while ago and he said “if they could sell their house to someone else, they would!” I agree!
[ Edited by louisgeorges on Date 08/30/2004 ]
my partner and i have been putting up bandit signs for the past few months and we got a call a while back from the city saying they would fine us, so we stoped putting signs on city property and starting putting them only on state owned roads like highway exit ramps and main streets. today my partner got a call from the state saying they are illegal and will fine us. we thought to ourselves that someone must be complaining because my partners dad works for the state and says they dont care they just throw em out. so today i get a call from a restricted number i usually never pick up but my partner said maybe its the state and you can just hang up if it is, the voice on the other end asks me for my name right away i knew this was shady. i told him that i wanted his name first and why he was calling well we got into a heated conversation about my signs ruining the entire town and how they are trashy advertising and how he has an advertising phobia and has sued telemarketers sucessfully. he told me he was going around a throwing all my signs out. i tried to reason with him at first but it didnt work, so basically i told him i have more signs then he can possibly throw away and that he can complain and the state can fine me all they want but it wont stop my signs, i told him i will make enough money off of these signs to buy a thousand more signs. i called him a "lowlife tree hugging envirmentalist loser" and he just kept repeating himself about how what im doing is illegal and that the laws dont care about what i think. i really gave it to him at the end of our conversation. i used extremly foul language which resulted in him hanging up on me. sometimes you just have to be brutal with people like that.
i never gave him my name and this will probably result in me reactivating my prepaid cellphone which is in an imaginary persons name and address. i wish he would have called from a unrestricted number so i could find were he lives and put signs in his front lawn. i really find it unbeleivable that someone would waste there time going around collecting my signs all day. what a lowlife. JEB.
P.S. i hope i didnt offend anyone i was just trying to add some insight into the trouble of putting up bandit signs and disgruntled citizens.
[ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/02/2004 ]
[ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/02/2004 ]
[ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/02/2004 ][ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/02/2004 ]
no, but i can bet that this guy has speeded before so isnt that illegal, and he is stealing my personal property, so he condones stealing but dosnt condone advertising. some small buisnesses like myself dont have the money that these major corporations have to buy large advertisments every where so we have to resort to bandit signs and the cheapest ads we can find, i have to eat too.
in no way am i trashing the neigborhood i put signs only in bad sections of town and off of highways. the town i live in is not greenwich by any means.
i also offered to reason with him and pick up any signs that were in a certain area. but he seemed content that all advertising was wrong and bothered him no matter what kind of adds they are.
he said my signs "are in your face trash" its not like my signs are made with magic markers they are done nicely with screen print and are not to be confused with mcdonalds rappers that people throw on the ground.
P.S. its a police officers job to pull people over for speeding, its a state workers job to throw out bandit signs, this guy dosnt work for the state and is probably collecting unemployment wasting our taxpayers money and driving around picking up signs all day long as he stated in our conversation.
[ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/02/2004 ]
[ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/02/2004 ]
[ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/02/2004 ][ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/02/2004 ]
i would love to pay for a permit to put my bandit signs up on state or city property, but unfortunatly i have a better chance of having lunch with donald trump then i do getting a permit for signs.
Zin - if you can't do business ethically then you aren't doing business, you're just a clown with a hobby pretending to be a business man. Sorry, harsh, but if you can't do business legally you're just another lowlife who gives real estate investors a bad name. It's a slippery slope and you are already sliding down it. There are people who can rationalize anything. I knew a guy much like yourself who conned old widows, he defended himself much like yourself, his rationalization was that he wasn't doing anything wrong since they had more money then they could spend before they died anyways.
Rehabinator, is that something like the Terminator or what? first off you do not know me so dont say you do.
secondly i dont see anything wrong with advertising with bandit signs, there are alot worse things happening in this world right now other then my bandit signs. this person who is making the complaints is worried about me making the town look trashy but he dosnt complain about the people selling crack all over down town and the prostitutes that frequent the area. i know alot of extremly successfull investors who also use bandit signs. it is definetly not illegal it may violate city zoning laws but illegal is the wrong word, you cant send someone to jail for violating a zoning law.
you should be talking, "rationalizing anything" your comparing bandit sign advertising to coning old widows you cant be serious!
I see your point of veiw, and i most certaintly do not agree with you, i always try to help people out that are in tuff situations and make money at the same time. i never said anything about conning anyone, your obviously dillusional and insicure. i will advertise in anyway i feel necessary to help people out of a tuff situation. if there is something wrong with that then so be it. but i am comfortable with what i do, and always try to be as ethical as possible when doing buisness. since you are a rehabber then you obviously have to evict people to get in and do the work so is evicting and kicking someone out on the street a ethical practice? now go do some Terminating. Jeb.
[ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/03/2004 ][ Edited by ZinOrganization on Date 09/03/2004 ]
Ok, guys, give me a break. I see nothing wrong with free advertising. Why is it ok for the Gymnastics and Cheerleading school, the Pool Guy, the Gutter and Deck Guy, Fashion Bug and any and every restaurant to put up bandit signs by the mall in the median, but I and my fellow investors cannot? Nobody wastes time taking THOSE signs down. Why? Because those are "legitimate" business?
Phooey.
medusa00, i agree with you 100%. as long as its done in a tasteful manor no one should have a problem with it, but unfortunatly some do. then they single us out because we are the small guys and not the big corporations. but im not one to lay down if someone is going to sue or charge me with something then i will fight back. Jeb.
Bandit signs are illegal in many areas; Violators can be issued municipal court citation, which is a Class C Misdemeanor. Fines for this misdemeanor are between $100 to $500 in many areas.
Bandit signs do work if you use technique in their placement.
I search the legal newspaper for several upcoming foreclosures in the same subdivision (This is what I call finding fertile land), next I place Bandit signs at or near the most active areas of entrance to the subdivision (this is what I call planting seeds), Now I just wait for the calls (I call this harvest time).
If the politicians can do it, so can we.
I get a phone call warning (if you're lucky) before being fined. I will tell you if the market is strong I will happily pay a $500 fine to make $5,000 - $10,000 - $15,000 or more. It's a lot cheaper than running a newspaper add for 30 days.
See:
http://www.thecreativeinvestor.com/ViewTopic31908-30-11.html
Quote:
On 2004-02-02 13:04, louisgeorges wrote:
I talk to a lot of investors all over the county, at investor club meeting and at a few investing clinics I took and they all agree that in Palm Beach county they don’t really enforce the laws about bandit signs.
They also don't always enforce the laws about prositution. What's your point? So you already know you are breaking the law. The county refers to them as "Snipe Signs" and yes they are illegal. Apparently, you don't care. If that is the case, don't be surprised when you get calls from angry citizens who don't want you trashing their neighborhood.
Don't be surprised when you find one of your own signs glued to your front door.
There are areas in West Palm Beach, where the residents actively remove the signs. A sign posted 15 feet in the air is no problem either. The property owners are quite resourceful.
If the county removes your signs, at their option, they can charge you. If you don't pay, they can place a code enforcement lien on any real estate you own in the county. They won't buy your story that a competitor placed the sign there.
Signs are only legal on private property, with the owner's permission and a sign permit from the county. Even then, you are restricted by the size of the lettering and the sign.
It's pretty simple, people don't do business with people who they know are willing to break the law. Why don't you simply spend the same money placing an ad in the Palm Beach Post? By posting signs on street corners, you immediately announce to the world that you are not a professional.
Maybe it has something to do with being from New Jersey?
Quote:
On 2004-09-02 19:29, ZinOrganization wrote:
no, but i can bet that this guy has speeded before so isnt that illegal, and he is stealing my personal property, so he condones stealing but dosnt condone advertising.
I hate to be the one to tell you this. He is not stealing your personal property. Once you discard (place) that sign on a public right of way, it becomes litter. Anyone who is of a mind to be a good citizen, may remove your litter without fear of breaking any law.
Quote:
i will advertise in anyway i feel necessary to help people out of a tuff situation.
Give me a break. Don't confuse yourself with a non-profit organization and a for profit business.
Some people have a set of ethics they do business by and others ethics are on a sliding scale based upon what they can get away with, you being the latter.
I know tons of guys like you, and your methods permeate your entire lifestyle. Guys with your ethics are the same ones who can't offer a decent relationship to their wives, have always been regarded as out for themselves instead of good friends to their friends.
Keep up the good work and keep your eye on the all-mighty dollar. People with your outlook are just like monkeys climbing a pole, the higher they climb up it in total disregard to others the more their ass shows.
Bandit Signs are a nuisance in my area. I do know the board of county commissions is trying to find a better way to make the posters of those signs suffer. I had one jerk who really did stick one on my lot near the road - I am on a corner and I was hard pressed not to zap him with tresapssing charges.
There are enough public places for that stuff without intruding on someone else's property.
I do know that places will fine you after they find the 3rd sign - greenacres definitely does
I see this topic come and go for some time now.
One thing I would ask all the people who post these bandit signs do you really think they work? Would you go and call a number on a bandit sign for one reason or another?
Bandit signs are nothing more then a eye sore to the neighborhoods. <just look at all the ones the litter all the roadways this election season> Now I am sure some of the people on here do not agree with my thoughts on this topic and they have every right to feel that way.
You want to target a area and get a decent reply use mass mailers like the ones that all the coupons come in the mail with. Or get the door hangers.
One last thought how many times did you see someone stop look for a pen and paper to write down a number on some bandit sign in town?
louisgeorge
I work in Tequesta I KNOW there is no tolerance for any signs there ,even for neighborhood business that want to advertise a little closer to the road. like putting the sign out in the morning and taking it in at closing .They'll silll get ya and a big fine too
LynLinz,
A friend of mine bought a tennis store in North Palm Beach. To advertise he put a “on sale” sign by the side of the road thinking he could just bring it in every day and there wouldn’t be a problem. On the third day the code enforcement guy walk in the store with the sign in his hand saying it was illegal. He said, “If you wants to advertise like this, it as to be a one time special event and you need to apply for a permit with the city!” Signs in residential neighborhoods, now that’s an eye sore. If they want to crack down on that, I understand completely (personally, I stopped putting signs out too much of a pain in the…). Signs in a commercial area people expect to see that, some of them are 30 feet high and 15 feet across! Plus it’s not like he just leaves it there, he puts it back in his store every night! I really think that the city should relax a little and give the small business owner a chance!
Louis
[ Edited by louisgeorges on Date 11/07/2004 ]