DISCOLORED HARDWOOD FLOORS
Hi guys,
I just completely re-sanded some pine hardwood floors using a drum-sander. Before I sanded, it looked like at one point the floor was coated with a schlack but had an area rug in the center of the room that wore off the coating. Around the edges of the room was still coated in the dark topcoat. After sanding, the outside edges looked brand new (very light pine color). However, the center of the room is a darker color (where the schlack wore off). I sanded down pretty far so sanding it out wont work. Any suggestions? I'd rather not stain the outside edges to match the inside because I like the light pine color. Has anyone run into this problem? It looks like there's still an area rug on the floor.
Bummer! I had the same thing happen on an older home that we owned one time. Stains on hardwood floors are usually shallow and can be sanded out. However, stains on pine can go extremely deep. We had some boards that we pulled up and the stains went about half way through. Probably you would hit the nails and damage the T&G before you could get deep enough to sand them out. We tried bleaching the stains initally but it was too difficult to match. Finally we stained the floors a dark cherry color and we had numerous people comment on how beatiful they were.
Do you think it would be worth trying the bleach? I really like the lighter color as opposed to a dark. Ive heard bleaching is pretty tough. If worse comes to worse I guess I could stain it dark like you did.
I've successfully done the bleaching before. Just get a pro air mask and glood gloves.
You might consider a pickling technique or stain. Like a white pickling, or even another light color. Minwax makes some great stain colors. The white would keep your color light and if done properly, still allow your yellow pine look to come through, but probably hide the color variations to a large degree. Get some raw pine boards and do some experimenting and testing before tackling the whole floor to be sure you like it.
Good luck,
Terry
If it really means that much to you, you can get a hardwood floor guy in there. I had an in-the-floor-grate area repaired once, and you couldn't tell that the wood had been replaced they did such a good job.
Thanks for all the responses guys. Anyone else have any luck with bleaching????
As was mentioned above, it doesn't hurt to try. If you have plenty of patience you might get it close. Then if you went back and used a light, or diluted stain to add a small amount of color to the entire floor it might not be noticable. Good luck.
How do you go about bleaching them? Do you use regular household bleach? dilute it? How do you apply it? Any info would greatly help.
I install hardwood in all my homes,....custom and spec. At the same time I advise my homeowners that plan on putting throw / area rugs down....to remove them ever so often, as well as closing the shades when natural light is not needed. Even when lighting (ultra violet rays) is not as much as a problem.....aging will still effect the color of any wood.
Within the last two weeks I had over 1800 sq ft of 60 year old oak flooring refinished and added about 6 sq ft in a closet......you could easily tell the difference between the two areas.
These floor also had the discoloration from rugs and age............however after the refinishing was complete everything was uniform.
This was oak....which is a true hardwood,........pine is not a hardwood per se, and as another member pointed out.....it stains deeper because of it open pourous attibutes.
Again, regardless of which species of wood one has.......rugs should be removed ever so often..........
NC
Many long years ago, driven by the scourge of poverty, I decided to finish the pine floors of this adorable slightly tilted 675 sq.ft. house I bought in a wilderness called West Hollywood.
I had done all the interior work, new paint, a few windows a toilet to replace the one that dated back to early neotholic time. All done except the floor.
So I read the book, rented the drum sander and the little one for the corners and away I went.
Well four beers latter I was finished. Yes I had sanded the floors and in the process created a rather interesting series of dips and valleys. I latter figured out that these were caused when I stopped with the machine still running.
I sealed and stained a dark cherry this after excessive cleaning. The floors looked I thought really great The three coats of polyurathane made them glisten. But the valleys and dips were still there. Probably still there to this day.
In any case that is how I learned to do floors. I have learned my lesson, I do not do floors, I have them done. I stay away and only come back when the work is completed.
What I really like are the cheapy floors that you just attach around the perimeter.
I am what is called in the trade, "Floor Challenged!"
Cheers Lucius (floor clutz)
We tried this many years ago. I do remember that we tried both common bleach full strength, and the bleach you can get specifically for wood which I imagine is basically the same thing. They seemed to work about the same. Anyhow, to the best of my memory all you do is pour the stuff on and watch the floor gradually lighten over a few minutes and then mop/rinse it off. The trick is that the wood will lighten up in a rather sharp line right along the edge of the bleach. You have to try to somehow get this edge to match the edge of your stain. It definately looked better when we finished, but It still wasn't close enough that I would have just put a clear poly on it. If you end up going with a dark stain you can still have problems if you didn't get a smooth sand on the floor. Any grooves will stain more darkly and the floor could look worse. If you grooved up the floor any while you were sanding it you may have to try a solid stain or give up and go with carpet.
I've refinished several objects from doors to funiture. Often water rings are on the funiture and when i've finished sanding there is still a ring.
Bleach (Clorox) works well full strength. Be careful of the fumes and use a spray bottle to put it on the floor. Pouring it on will just make a puddle. Let it sit for a few minutes and wipe it up. It could take an overnight application if the wood is really dark.
Find out if your floors are White oak or Red oak. Go to a corner and put a little polyeurathane on it and see if the finish is true white or tinted. If you over bleach the spot, it could make it obvious and then you have another problem.
Go slow and don't rush it. It will come out fine, the hard work, stripping and sanding is already done.
Jay
Thanks guys. Great tips!! I'll do a followup post to let everyone know how I made out.
Ryan
Good luck Ryan,
Let us know how it looks when you finish. As a first job we do not mind valleys and dips and the renters would not too. Well, I guess
Good luck again!
Hi Guys,
Just an update. I've sprayed on a few layers of bleach and after the first 2 layers, I wasn't too happy with the outcome. It seems some of the boards took the bleach a little differently and decided to turn some real ugly greenish colors (mostly ones that have some strange looking grain within them). However, after a few more layers (letting them dry in between) the wood is really starting to lighten up. It still has an orangish tint to it and isnt lightening up as uniformly as I wanted but seems to be working. As I said, some boards arent looking fresh out of the mill, but the color is starting to look closer. I think after a few more layers and some more fun with the old drum sander and a good coat of poly, I think she'll be alright. I'll let everyone know how it looks if your not all retired by the time i'm done.
First, make sure you rinse, rinse, rinse to get any chlorine residue out of the wood.
even on pine. Oh, and I would use a stain that uses a dye for color instead of a solid pigment. You'll get a really rich warm tone. Of course, the suggestion of using a white pigmented stain is also a good one.
You can get Oxalic Acid crystals at your local hardware store...the "poor man's" wood bleach. It's great for light to moderately stained (I mean soiled, not stained in the sense of a pigment) wood. Just follow the directions.
For a moderate to severe job, purchase a two part bleaching kit (hydrogen peroxide w/ a catalyzing agent). You may need a couple of applications.
Once you've evened up the color of the wood, sand smooth because all of the water will cause the grain of the wood to swell. Then lay down just one full application with a clear, non-pigmented oil-based stain. If you can't find a clear stain, ask for an oil-based "sandable" varnish and thin it down 20% with a good quality paint thinner and use instead of stain.
This sealing process will even out the porosity of the wood. More pourous areas will absorb more of your clear stain, less pourous area take less of it. Your wood may take on a slight amber hue, but it will mostly fade when your sealer fully dries.
If you wish to add color, now you lightly sand again, wipe up the dust and apply a colored stain. You should at this point get very even results with only mild darkening in the grain of the wood (no "blotchiness"
Then simply apply your favorite finish (polyurethane, spar varnish, shellac, etc.) in several coats sanding in between and you're good to go.
Granted it's a lot of work, but the results can well be worth it.
if you are bleaching wood you use oxalic acid...good luck C.Walker
whoops...just noticed wannabe's post...its right on...C>Walker
No matter what you try ( and clorox is the cheapest and the best ) your not going to be able to make it match perfect. What your seeing is punkin pine its a natural darking of the wood.
Bleach the best you can then stain to match is the best you can do it works well and you will not have to go to darklet dry then -LIGHTLY- sand again, put water based polyurathane(not oil based as that will only darken it )you'll have a floor that will impress even your mother in law.
Ed
Thanks for all the tips guys. I'm in the process of doing another room and have run into the same problem. I wasnt real impressed with how the clorox worked out. There are a lot of white and grey spots even though I applied it evenly with a spray bottle. I'd rather not go with bleaching it this time. If I put on a coat of stain, will it just make the dark darker and the light darker? Will they still not match? Can I put 2 coats of stain on the light parts to match it to the darker? Can I avoid using the bleach altogether? I'm hearing some people say seal it then stain it. Others say stain it without sealing it. Is one way better than the other? Sorry so many questions.
What I was trying to say in my last answer was to stain the lighter areas to blend in with the darker. the bleaching will just lighten it up some but you will never get blond colored pine.
ED
Okay...here is some skinny on bleaches.
There are three basic types: Chlorine, Peroxide, and Oxalic Acid.
When do I use a Chlorine bleach?
Use a chlorine bleach (Clorox for one) when you need a general purpose bleaching, or you are bleaching wood that has been dye-stained. May require a number of applications. If you want a stronger chloring based product, get swimming pool bleach which is a dry compound called calcium hypoclorite.
When do I use a peroxide bleach?
The two part (sodium hydroxide + hydrogen peroxide) bleaching system is best when you need to remove the natural color of wood, or need to lighten wood stained with a pigmented stain. This bleach does not work well on dye-stained wood.
When do I use oxalic acid?
Use oxalic acid in place of peroxide bleach when you don't need something that strong (to remove natural color or lighten pigmented stain). Also, oxalic acid is preferred for woods containing tannic acid (redwood, cedar, cherry, mahogony, some oak, etc.) where the tannins have aged the wood to a gray color. Finally, oxalic acid is preferred for woods where iron in tap water causes black stains (very common with oak).
You'd be best to use liberal amounts of distilled water to rinse ESPECIALLY if you're going from an attempt of one type of bleach to another. If you use oxalic acid, after your last application mix a neutralizer consisting of two heaping teaspoons of baking soda to one quart water and spread on the wood.
As far as application, they're relatively straight forward. Apply to the entire surface (not just the darkened area) and wait...rinse...repeat if necessary. If a second application of a particular bleach hasn't done the trick, a third application isn't going to do you any good. Try another bleach, sand more, or replace the wood.
You said that the floor darkened in areas where the finish was worn. Thus, I suspected that you had ground-in grime or moisture had set in. Since you sanded down quite far, you probably got through the grime. So, my vote would be for oxalic acid first...then try the chlorine if oxalic is ineffective.
Hi. I was a wood floor contractor for 20 years. Not sure how much you sanded down but if you removed varnish completely the color difference is normal. When a rug is place on the floor the outside edges are exposed to sunlight. This naturally changes the calor. There is no way to resolve it. Bleach often makes things worse. Just pu a nice high golss finish on it and it will still look nice. If left uncovered the color difference will get less and less. Try coverin a portion of natural wood outside and then uncover it and you will see what I mean. JIm